Proposal: Engineer limits on some maps

[Gump]

Let me start off by saying we all know it: Sentry nests are bad. They're not any fun in pubs, yet little more than a slight nuisance in scrims.



To help keep pubs fun and refreshing and keep the balance of TF2, I propose Engineer / sentry limits. Some maps are extremely inbalanced even without sentries (I'm lookin' at you, Goldrush) so I seek to help keep this balance in line. 

1-Engineer limit on ctf_mach4, pl_goldrush, cp_fastlane

2-Engineer limit on cp_dustbowl, cp_well, ctf_well, tc_hydro, cp_steel, cp_badlands

And a 3-Engineer limit on all other maps.

Thoughts? Suggestions? Flame? Shoot, and shit.

In before pro-Engineer nerd flame.

[Dave]

[nerd flame!]

sentries arent all that tough.

[CaffeinePowered]

[nerd flame!]

sentries arent all that tough.

I can see mach4 have 2, and maybe dustbowl/goldrush having 3, but I wouldn't go as low at 1 on any map.

[Gump]

Like I said they're little thread in a pug where everyone has a mic and people are organized. In alltalk 24-player Spamrush, they're lethal.

[Honest]

People actually win Hydro? Sorry, this chart is confusing.

[CaffeinePowered]

People actually win Hydro? Sorry, this chart is confusing.

Sudden death counts as a win

[Gump]

As stated in the commentary, stalemates / sudden deaths are a loss for both teams.

[Honest]

I guess if I were to comment on the actual subject matter, class limits usually aren't a problem on brbu except on CTF maps. I swear, get 2/3 caps on the opposite team and they freak the fuck out and Engi it up hard.

[KarthXLR]

I guess if I were to comment on the actual subject matter, class limits usually aren't a problem on brbu except on CTF maps. I swear, get 2/3 caps on the opposite team and they freak the fuck out and Engi it up hard.

This. A team shouldn't have to depend on an engineer to secure intel.

[Dave]

[quote author=Honest link=topic=2251.msg64334#msg64334 date=1233430028]
I guess if I were to comment on the actual subject matter, class limits usually aren't a problem on brbu except on CTF maps. I swear, get 2/3 caps on the opposite team and they freak the fuck out and Engi it up hard.

This. A team shouldn't have to depend on an the defence class to defend intel.
[/quote]

[jorge]

EF2 ftw

[Honest]

[quote author=Ye Salty Karth link=topic=2251.msg64337#msg64337 date=1233430301]
[quote author=Honest link=topic=2251.msg64334#msg64334 date=1233430028]
I guess if I were to comment on the actual subject matter, class limits usually aren't a problem on brbu except on CTF maps. I swear, get 2/3 caps on the opposite team and they freak the fuck out and Engi it up hard.

This. A team shouldn't have to depend on an the defence class to defend intel.
[/quote]
[/quote]

Of course they should. They just shouldn't have to rely on 4 of them. Mach 4 sucks when the game comes to a screeching halt because of EF2.

[Eschatos]

I say no way.  As restrictions are imposed the game becomes less fun.  There should never be class limits at any time.  If you have problems with engis, go spy or get an uber.  End of story.

[Vongore]

go talk about this on a pub server, when we all play here, well organized, sentries aren't a ptoblem

[KarthXLR]

go talk about this on a pub server, when we all play here, well organized, sentries aren't a ptoblem

Sentries aren't usually a problem.

There have been some instances where I wanted to strangle some of those engineers.

[Vongore]

[quote author=Vongore link=topic=2251.msg64370#msg64370 date=1233442685]
go talk about this on a pub server, when we all play here, well organized, sentries aren't a ptoblem

Sentries aren't usually a problem.

There have been some instances where I wanted to strangle some of those engineers.
[/quote]

The only engie i found annoying is Loqutus, the rest of them just know how where to plant their sentries AND they have 3+ more engies babysitting the nest

[Honest]

I say no way.  As restrictions are imposed the game becomes less fun.  There should never be class limits at any time.  If you have problems with engis, go spy or get an uber.  End of story.

You kind of missed the point. Spy becomes worthless with 3-4 engis, and you need to coordinate ubers to take out that many and even then 1 counteruber or pyro with airblast or stupid teammate will cock that up. The game becomes less fun to me when you alienate certain classes (I.e anything that isn't a medic, demo, or soldier). But yet again, this isn't really for every map since a lot of them are designed to hurt more than help if you play Sentry farm 2. Just stuff like CTF, imo.

[KarthXLR]

Conclusion of this thread:

Are Sentry Nests the new Crit Rockets?

[[fr31ns]Karrde]

I could see 2 on some maps, but otherwise, no.  90% of it would be solved by teamwork.  Grind out 3-4 ubers and no ABing pyro will do anything.  But sometimes you do just need to secure stuff just to stop the damned scout rush.

[Squishy3]

[quote author=Eschatos link=topic=2251.msg64368#msg64368 date=1233442584]
I say no way.  As restrictions are imposed the game becomes less fun.  There should never be class limits at any time.  If you have problems with engis, go spy or get an uber.  End of story.

You kind of missed the point. Spy becomes worthless with 3-4 engis, and you need to coordinate ubers to take out that many and even then 1 counteruber or pyro with airblast or stupid teammate will cock that up. The game becomes less fun to me when you alienate certain classes (I.e anything that isn't a medic, demo, or soldier). But yet again, this isn't really for every map since a lot of them are designed to hurt more than help if you play Sentry farm 2. Just stuff like CTF, imo.
[/quote]You don't need to coordinate ubers. if you actually bother to coordinate team members you need just one. Medic runs out front like he should, absorbs fire. All of the team that's not on guard duty rushes in after. Sentries no longer prove a threat.